Microsoft's Surface Studio 2 Plus Ships With an RTX 3060 for $4,299 (theverge.com) 57
It's been a long time since Microsoft updated its Surface Studio line of all-in-one PCs. While rumors had suggested a Surface Studio 3 was on the way, Microsoft is debuting its Surface Studio 2 Plus today instead -- an upgrade on the Surface Studio 2 that launched four years ago. It includes some important upgrades on the inside, but the exterior is practically the same, and it all starts at an eye-watering $4,299. From a report: The Surface Studio 2 Plus will ship with Intel's 11th Gen Core i7-11370H processor, a chip that's rapidly approaching two years on the market. We're about to enter Intel's 13th Gen era, so it's hugely disappointing to see Microsoft not move to 12th Gen H series chips or wait for Intel's latest and greatest. "Our goal was ship to market sooner, especially for a lot of our commercial customers... so we focused on stability and supply with known good parts because the difference from 11th to 12th Gen on the H series wasn't something we needed to push for," explains Pete Kyriacou, vice president of program management at Microsoft, in an interview with The Verge. Despite the disappointing CPU choice, Microsoft has opted for a graphics card upgrade here. The Surface Studio 2 Plus comes with Nvidia's RTX 3060 laptop GPU with 6GB of VRAM. Microsoft has redesigned its Surface Studio 2 Plus motherboard, and the RTX 3060 itself will be running at around 60-70 watts in a laptop configuration. Microsoft hides all of the components in the Studio 2 Plus inside a little laptop-like enclosure underneath the 28-inch display.
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Yes, it is number between 4 and 5, and implies a culture that uses comma as a decimal separator even in English.
just trying to be like Apple (Score:2, Flamebait)
Expensive all-in-one with a two-year-old CPU, that is literally exactly what Apple's known for.
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It's a professional/hobbyist media creation device.
The display supports two popular colorspaces, neither of which is particular important to gamers, streamers, etc. The screen is high-res, wide gamut, and high color accuracy---and it supports multitouch and stylus with degrees of pressure.
This thing is basically one of the biggest digital art tablets that you can get, which happens to include a decent PC. Comparing it to a regular PC is, quite frankly, ignorant.
If you're not doing graphics work, this wasn't
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If you're not doing graphics work, this wasn't designed for you.
Also, if I want current hardware, this is not for me. We have a laptop with multitouch and wacom in the house. It's neat, and this would be even better. But they're asking a lot for yesterday's hardware.
Comment removed (Score:3)
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Pc (Score:3, Informative)
The only reason to buy PCs was because they were cheaper than Macs.
This is the worst of both worlds.
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I dunno, maybe the 30xx GPU is still current-gen if 40xx isn't in laptops yet, but the 3060 laptop GPU was launched almost 2 years ago.
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I'm just not seeing why it has a previous-gen CPU and GPU at this price.
I dunno, maybe the 30xx GPU is still current-gen if 40xx isn't in laptops yet, but the 3060 laptop GPU was launched almost 2 years ago.
I'm not sure about the Intel proc but the 30xx for laptops is still current gen. They've not been out that long for computers and have only recently became widely available. The high end 40xx series have only just come out for desktops, the mid and low range are a while off and the mobile versions are a while after that.
The big issue here is that it's 4 fucking grand. I bought an Asus with an Ryzen 5 and 3050 for £600 (about US$700) a few months back. Even if you want a high end laptop, your starti
Re: Pc (Score:2)
I bought a laptop from Dell two years ago that blows the pants off this for only slightly more. 8-core Xeon, Quadro RTX5000 graphics (roughly equivalent to a 3080, iirc), 128GB RAM, 1TB storage, with spots for three additional pci-e m.2 sticks, which I filled with a 1TB, 4TB, and 4TB SSDs, which I run pairwise in raid-0. The total cost, then, was about $6k. Today, I could probably get exactly the same machine for half that. And they're charging $4.3k for half the machine and it's not even a laptop. Fuck tha
Cune? (Score:2)
The only reason to buy PCs was because they were cheaper than Macs.
That, and they fact that they're better in every conceivable way.
It sounds like MS may be trying to pull a "Zune" on the high end PC market, the Zune was technically superior to the Ipod it competed against but was subject to successive and severe marketing and design failures. There's no point in making a better product if it looks terrible and no-one wants to buy it.
My experience with Microsoft Surfaces via work is "just buy anything else". A decent Dell will be cheaper, better quality and will beha
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the Zune was technically superior to the Ipod it competed against but was subject to successive and severe marketing and design failures.
Ahem.
If Zunes had "successive and severe [. . .] design failures." How in the living FUCK can they be "technically superior to the iPod"???
. . .and to which iPod are you comparing the Zune?
You Haters are so pathetic.
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The Zune was superior to the competing iPod with a hard drive (its competitor) when it came out. It had FM radio, Wi-Fi, and usually equal or larger storage for the same or lower price point. It also had a better screen and navigation.
Also the Firewire charging on the iPod was stupid (choosing Firewire was a mistake to begin with).
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The Zune was superior to the competing iPod with a hard drive (its competitor) when it came out. It had FM radio, Wi-Fi, and usually equal or larger storage for the same or lower price point. It also had a better screen and navigation.
Also the Firewire charging on the iPod was stupid (choosing Firewire was a mistake to begin with).
Firewire for iPod was actually a great feature, for a device initially aimed for Mac Users, all of whom had ready access to FireWire. Not to mention that FireWire was far superior to USB for transporting large amounts of data; something that USB truly sucked at until USB 3.0.
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so great of a feature that even Apple discontinued it and chose USB2 instead.
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so great of a feature that even Apple discontinued it and chose USB2 instead.
Wrong, Hater.
Although technically far superior to USB 1 and USB 2, FireWire never achieved widespread adoption on the Windows platform. And since Apple wanted to expand the wildly-popular iPod's market to Windows Users, the decision to drop FireWire after (IIRC) the 2nd generation of iPod was a sensible one.
But if you read the Apple-Oriented tech press at the time, Mac users groused quite a bit about the loss of fast FireWire iPod synching.
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Although technically far superior to USB 1 and USB 2, FireWire never achieved widespread adoption on the Windows platform.
And everybody knew that widespread adoption would never come because Firewire was too expensive with little added benefit.
And since Apple wanted to expand the wildly-popular iPod's market to Windows Users, the decision to drop FireWire after (IIRC) the 2nd generation of iPod was a sensible one.
So, exactly as I said, Apple discontinued it and chose USB2 instead. And even you (a clear Apple fanboy since you call everybody who criticize a single decision as a hater) admit this was a sensible decision.
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Although technically far superior to USB 1 and USB 2, FireWire never achieved widespread adoption on the Windows platform.
And everybody knew that widespread adoption would never come because Firewire was too expensive with little added benefit.
And since Apple wanted to expand the wildly-popular iPod's market to Windows Users, the decision to drop FireWire after (IIRC) the 2nd generation of iPod was a sensible one.
So, exactly as I said, Apple discontinued it and chose USB2 instead. And even you (a clear Apple fanboy since you call everybody who criticize a single decision as a hater) admit this was a sensible decision.
FireWire wasn't "too expensive" (IIRC, there was a whopping $0.25 license per unit); and, even just considering the first generation FireWire 400, it still had massively greater throughput than USB 2; because the Protocol was simply designed from the ground-up to stream large amounts of data, whereas USB 1 and 2 were openly hostile by design to high-bandwidth-requiring Peripherals.
It wasn't a "smart decision"; it was something Apple was simply forced into to expand iPod sales into the Windows-Using market.
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But if you read the Apple-Oriented tech press at the time, Mac users groused quite a bit about the loss of fast FireWire iPod synching.
Of course the Apple-Oriented tech press didn't want to admit it was wrong when they first said that FireWire was the best choice for the iPod.
Just like the Apple-Oriented tech press who said for years that 3.5" was the perfect screen size for a smartphone.
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But if you read the Apple-Oriented tech press at the time, Mac users groused quite a bit about the loss of fast FireWire iPod synching.
Of course the Apple-Oriented tech press didn't want to admit it was wrong when they first said that FireWire was the best choice for the iPod.
Just like the Apple-Oriented tech press who said for years that 3.5" was the perfect screen size for a smartphone.
FireWire was the best choice for the iPod; when it was a Mac-only Product.
And enough people actually preferred the 3.7" Form-Factor that Apple felt it necessary to re-introduce iPhones in a non-Phablet size, after they decided to give in to Marketing pressure to offer iPhones that started to look more like an iPad Mini than a "classic" iPhone.
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The smallest iPhone now have a 4.7" screen.
Apple fanboys said for years that 3.5" was the perfect size.
Tying a music player to a specific brand of computers was a very dumb idea to begin with.
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The smallest iPhone now have a 4.7" screen.
Apple fanboys said for years that 3.5" was the perfect size.
Tying a music player to a specific brand of computers was a very dumb idea to begin with.
Actually, it was primarily Steve Jobs that said for years that the original iPhone was the perfect size. It was iPhone owners that eventually pressured Apple to join the Phablet craze.
You have to remember that in 2001, Apple was not the juggernaut it is now. Apple (nor anyone) was not expecting the iPod to virtually take over the already-mature Music Player market in such a short time; so, when the iPod was designed, it was expected that it would become a Mac accessory only.
It is only hindsight that makes y
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The smallest iPhone now have a 4.7" screen.
Apple fanboys said for years that 3.5" was the perfect size.
Tying a music player to a specific brand of computers was a very dumb idea to begin with.
Actually, it was primarily Steve Jobs that said for years that the original iPhone was the perfect size. It was iPhone owners that eventually pressured Apple to join the Phablet craze.
A lot of fanboys just repeated whatever Saint Steve said. I didn't see much complain among vocal iPhone owners, but yes of course, Apple saw that they were losing market share to Android competitors with larger screens.
You have to remember that in 2001, Apple was not the juggernaut it is now. Apple (nor anyone) was not expecting the iPod to virtually take over the already-mature Music Player market in such a short time; so, when the iPod was designed, it was expected that it would become a Mac accessory only.
It was a dumb move even back then. Anybody with half a brain could see that. If you design a music player so that it can work only with PCs from a single vendor with about 10% market share, and pretend that it is a feature, you deserve to be killed by Fire (not Wire this time).
Just like it wo
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And I also forgot the most important:
If you buy a music player which somehow only works on computers from one vendor with only ~10% market share, you also deserve to be killed by Fire as a customer. Painting yourself in a corner is never a good idea. When you are going to change your PC, you will likely want to continue to use your music player, and limiting yourself to one vendor would be really dumb.
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I understand the appeal of Firewire until USB2 was released, but not after that. It was not worth it, especially not for a music player.
And the iPod became popular after the switch to USB, not before.
Spoken like a person who has never used a FireWire-Equipped External HDD, compared with the exact same Drive using its USB 2 interface.
It is night and day different. Period.
USB 2 literally slows down peripherals that request more bandwidth, on purpose. It is the way the Protocol for USB 1 and 2 were designed. USB 3's Protocol added a "Streaming Data" (don't recall the actual name) mode that changed all that, not to mention much higher bitrates.
And the early iPods were designed well before USB 3.
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And I also forgot the most important:
If you buy a music player which somehow only works on computers from one vendor with only ~10% market share, you also deserve to be killed by Fire as a customer. Painting yourself in a corner is never a good idea. When you are going to change your PC, you will likely want to continue to use your music player, and limiting yourself to one vendor would be really dumb.
Again, as I said before, when the first iPods were designed, I'm pretty sure that even SJ didn't envision that they would totally take over the PMP market from the Googolplex of already-available Players out there. Afterall, The market was already too saturated with the non-lame Nomads of the world! But, fortunately for Apple, every-single-other-Player's UI sucked Donkey Balls so wholeheartedly and with such Gusto that the entire Planet wanted an iPod. . . NOW!
So, the real mistake was actually all the other
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Also, two other things:
1. People seldom change away from Macs.
2. You can get a FireWire (a/k/a IEEE 1394) card for a PeeCee for about $30. Windows has full support. Problem solved!
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Also, two other things:
1. People seldom change away from Macs.
2. You can get a FireWire (a/k/a IEEE 1394) card for a PeeCee for about $30. Windows has full support. Problem solved!
1. Part of the explanation is that Mac buyers tend to make stupid choices such as getting a music player working only with their Mac. It's called vendor lock-in.
2. Having the port is only part of it. Did the software even allow to connect a 1st-gen iPod to a windows PC? Also Firewire add-in cards for laptop suck, because the port is too big so it enlarge the laptop. Or you need a dongle. In both case, it sucks and it's not worth it over USB2 for a music player.
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Also, two other things:
1. People seldom change away from Macs.
2. You can get a FireWire (a/k/a IEEE 1394) card for a PeeCee for about $30. Windows has full support. Problem solved!
1. Part of the explanation is that Mac buyers tend to make stupid choices such as getting a music player working only with their Mac. It's called vendor lock-in.
2. Having the port is only part of it. Did the software even allow to connect a 1st-gen iPod to a windows PC? Also Firewire add-in cards for laptop suck, because the port is too big so it enlarge the laptop. Or you need a dongle. In both case, it sucks and it's not worth it over USB2 for a music player.
Say what you will; but in the end, the iPod helped Apple's brand recognition immeasurably. That "halo effect" was a real thing.
Quite frankly, if Microsoft didn't have such an (undeserved) entrenched position in the Workplace, Apple might well have been able to parlay that halo effect into much larger marketshare than they did. As it was, they still more than doubled their marketshare (especially in the US) in fairly short order. And in case of small entrepreneurial businesses, I dare say that Apple might ev
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they have about 10-15% market share, and from my experience it's much lower in the business world, including small businesses.
Just because it is higher in some countries or some sectors (like video editing) doesn't change that.
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they have about 10-15% market share, and from my experience it's much lower in the business world, including small businesses.
Just because it is higher in some countries or some sectors (like video editing) doesn't change that.
From my experience, your experience is at least 5-10 years out of date.
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And of course, you don't have any data to back up your claim. Let see:
Usage share of Mac web browsers is 15%
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
They sold only 7% of computers worldwide in Q4 2021
https://appleinsider.com/artic... [appleinsider.com]
According to this source they went from about 8% in 2013 to almost 15% in 2022:
https://www.statista.com/stati... [statista.com]
According to IDC, they have 9% market share, behind Lenovo, HP and Dell
https://www.appleworld.today/a... [www.appleworld.today]
So my 10-15% estimate was optimistic towards Apple, it might be even le
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And of course, you don't have any data to back up your claim. Let see:
Usage share of Mac web browsers is 15%
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
They sold only 7% of computers worldwide in Q4 2021
https://appleinsider.com/artic... [appleinsider.com]
According to this source they went from about 8% in 2013 to almost 15% in 2022:
https://www.statista.com/stati... [statista.com]
According to IDC, they have 9% market share, behind Lenovo, HP and Dell
https://www.appleworld.today/a... [www.appleworld.today]
So my 10-15% estimate was optimistic towards Apple, it might be even less. So your anecdotal experience is wrong.
No proof?
How about 23% in Enterprise Seats:
https://www.computerworld.com/... [computerworld.com]
"[U.S.] macOS usage has more than quadrupled from Jan. 2009 to Dec. 2020 to 30.62% (i.e. in Christmas month; and 34.72% in April 2020 in the middle of COVID-19"
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wik... [wikipedia.org]
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Your data is only about one specific country. Mine is worldwide.
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Your data is only about one specific country. Mine is worldwide.
So what?
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So you are wrong. And missed my point. Let's quote again my message which you contested:
they have about 10-15% market share, and from my experience it's much lower in the business world, including small businesses.
Just because it is higher in some countries or some sectors (like video editing) doesn't change that.
Unlike what you replied, I was not 5-10 years out of date. I was pretty much spot on.
P.S. there is a world outside the USA.
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Mainly dell shop at work and we have a handful of Surface Laptop 4's ... I've got one.
Honestly? It isn't bad. Pricey, though generally on-par with the 7000/9000 series latitudes it competes with. Their insistence on the stupid dock connector is like Apple clinging to Lightning ... except MS hasn't sold a billion plus devices that use it. At least they have USB-C...
MS "Warranty" is pitiful - anything goes wrong, they swap it out. Have fun reloading your everything, we don't care.
I'd much rather a Dell XP
Or because you like performance or games or linux (Score:2)
I am not saying App
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Plus WIndows is just snappier and faster.
This is perhaps the second-greatest tragedy of OSX, after it not being BeOS. Talk about snappy and fast... But NeXTStep was at least as responsive on a 68k with a SCSI drive on a 5MB/sec bus as OSX is on machines with orders of magnitude more performance of all types. Just being as responsive as the OS they based their OS on would have been better than what they accomplished.
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That computer is basically a $2,000 monitor connected to a $1,000 workstation with an added $1,300 markup.
An 11th gen Core-i7 and a GeForce 3060 are barely mid-tier parts at this point, it's the giant touch screen that makes it somewhat special.
MS Competing with Apple for Biggest Cunt Award (Score:3)
Enough said.
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it's a nasty problem, and there have been many cases of creeps using the airtags for stalking and vehicle thieves using them for tracing target vehicles.
There's an Android app "Tracker Detect on Android" that can find nearby airtags, so you don't have to buy an Apple device to find them.
https://www.cnet.com/tech/mobi... [cnet.com]
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Heat? (Score:2)
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Heat dissipation is a real problem with overly shrunk PCs. Most PCs need a certain amount of volume to accommodate the air needed to transfer heat away, and most Apples have cases that were shrunk as much as possible for asthetic reasons even if they compromise performance. If Apple put a bigger cooler on the same hardware they are shipping now then it would deliver more performance, but that would make the device heavier and bulkier. Never mind that the bulk in an all-in-one is behind the monitor where the
That much for a 3060? (Score:1)
Ridiculous (Score:2)
I am glad (Score:1)
Just a reminder (Score:2)
Only a couple of months ago Microsoft was still shipping the Surface Studio 2. This is significant because it didn't support Windows 11 until Microsoft cut out a very specific exception for the processor shipped in the Studio 2. None of the other 7th gen processors are supported.
Describe "upgrade" (Score:2)
Despite the disappointing CPU choice, Microsoft has opted for a graphics card upgrade here. The Surface Studio 2 Plus comes with Nvidia’s RTX 3060 laptop GPU with 6GB of VRAM
So MS did not select the worst NVidia 3000 series GPU; they selected the very bottom of midrange GPUs. There are 8 better NVidia GPUs that could have been selected. And they selected a laptop GPU. For $4300. The Verge seems to be polishing that turd really hard.